I found it kind of interesting too. His point is that white people have no business whatsoever singing Blues. Many of these absentee landlords lived in England. Or was World War II one of those rare examples of a just war? Personally, that seems to me a little more forthright, a little less hypocritical than the religious rationalization: This was Gods will. Topic: Jumping the Gun s Germs and Steel (37 of 56 Read essay famine great interdisciplinary irelands 46 times Conf: reading list books From: Candy Minx Date: Tuesday, December 12, 2000 11:54 AM David, we x-posted oops.
But his delivery is lacking. Wendall Barry, Rachel Carson. Bohinka Date: Sunday, December 24, 2000 10:54 PM Dale, Is it the sports guy Hamill that wrote Snow in August? ( The Pictorial essay famine great interdisciplinary irelands Times, 1846). Or sets of parents do if the kids were from different families? Sounds like a good discussion is in store. The whole point of this paragraph is to say that I think that Diamond is right. It has always been. He expressed the view that the resources of Ireland were still abundantly adequate to maintain the population, and that, until those resources had been utterly exhausted, he hoped that there was no one in "Ireland who. Holdings were so small that no crop other than potatoes would suffice to feed a family.
The shape of the continents, the differences in latitude either helping or hindering the transference of agriculture-it is one of the high points of this book. It is guilt and not reason that induces us to try. I know a lot of this is spontaneous and can't be planned. There they are, situated in that strategic position on the biggest continent with an East-West axis. A (1999 Mapping The Great Irish Famine, Four Courts Press, isbn Killen, John (1995 The Famine decade, contemporary accounts, Blackstaff Kinealy, Christine (1994 This Great Calamity, Gill Macmillan, isbn Laxton, Edward (1997 The Famine Ships: The Irish Exodus to America. It's actually both fascinating and a little sickening to me to see all that within one species. They remember when it wasn't too long ago that a person from another tribe might poison you. I bought the book and have read about 10 pages. Ruth Topic: Jumping the Gun s Germs and Steel (43 of 56 Read 43 times Conf: reading list books From: Daniel LeBoeuf Date: Tuesday, December 12, 2000 01:33 PM Ruth: Besides the social studies teacher, I remember attending. So why this annoying tactic? Blianta an droch-shaoil' (meaning: the years of the bad life) Foclir Gaeilge Béarla Indices of Donegal Annuals 1950s.
I was reminded of Diamond, who also looks at the atrocities of the past but does not blame genetics. Sometimes you just have to shake things up a bit around here. Their language is the same, except that the Serbs use the Cyrillic alphabet. 'Charity Begins at Home The United States Government Irish Famine Relief 18451849. The habit of visualization, which is second nature to us today, was then a novelty, a new way not so much of thinking about the infinite and ineffable as seeing and manipulating matters of finite and daily actuality. Population had increased by 1314 in the first three decades of the 19th century; between 18, population grew. Few had been sown, so, despite average yields, hunger continued.
By John Crowley, William. Of the more than 100,000 Irish that sailed to Canada in 1847, an estimated one out of five died from disease and malnutrition, including over 5,000 at Grosse Isle, Quebec, an island in the Saint Lawrence River used to quarantine ships near Quebec City. I was going to try a new book discussion group at the library. According to Donnelly, it became obvious that the quarter-acre clause was "indirectly a death-dealing instrument". He further notes that "a recent sophisticated computation estimates excess deaths from 1846 to 1851 as between 1,000,000 and 1,500,000. All I meant was that this is a form of determinism like Social Darwinism in the sense that one simply substitutes ample environmental resources for genetic superiority. But also what is part of what makes us human is our imagination and our natural sensuous pleasure of sharing and having fun. I believe you are saying that Diamond's theses provide only part of the explanation for events such as those that have occurred in the Balkans. Theresa, I am not a good or fair judge of taste, because as I have said here on another thread, I judge a book mainly on it's content, not on it's style. Some scholars estimate that the population of Ireland was reduced by 2025. They are suggesting that history or arts or anthropology have always been looked at and approached as non-scientific areas. Articles like this always get my imagination going.
Ishmael was made into a movie or rather a version of it was and it died in theatres. Fn 5 Joel Mokyr 's estimates at an aggregated county level range from.1 million.5 million deaths between 18Mokyr produced two sets of data which contained an upper-bound and lower-bound estimate, which showed not much difference in regional patterns. Laws that restricted the rights of Irish Catholics In the 17th and 18th centuries, Irish Catholics were strongly discriminated against. Ten other occupiers of land, though without tenants, were also murdered, she says. Furthermore, a disproportionate share of the potatoes grown in Ireland were of a single variety, the Irish Lumper. The Commission stated that bad relations between landlord and tenant were principally responsible. When one thinks about his anecdotes and metaphors and his broad view of history(this is what he has in common with Diamond) a reader feels things and wants to do things or at least think about the way we live. This in turn led to "progress" as we know. It's excellent and I just can't find it in my book journal. But I am haunted by this idea.
Eurasias east-west axis allowed for a speedy diffusion of crops along a rather temperate latitude. (Too, werent accountants constructing balance sheets in ancient times, albeit on stone?) Is all of this at odds with Diamonds theories, do you think, or could the two concepts co-exist? Sherwood Anderson, if I remember correctly. Which in turns makes me wonder how anybody in their right mind can become suicidal in the midst of this great party. The commissioners acknowledged that their figures were incomplete and that the true number of deaths was probably higher: The greater the amount of destitution of mortality. A significant different is that the Serbs are Serbian Orthodox and the Croatians are Roman Catholic, although one would think that those differences would have lost some of their edge after 50 years of Communist rule. MAP Topic: Dec 15 Discussion: Guns, Germs Steel essay famine great interdisciplinary irelands by Jared Diamond (9 of 71 Read 47 times Conf: reading list books From: David Moody Date: Monday, December 18, 2000 09:47 AM At first, I thought Diamond was extremely dispassionate, simply presenting a scientific hypothesis. 202 These include, at Custom House Quays, Dublin, the thin sculptural figures, by artist Rowan Gillespie, who are portrayed as if walking towards the emigration ships on the Dublin Quayside.
12 13 The famine and its effects permanently changed the island's demographic, political, and cultural landscape, producing an estimated two million refugees and spurring a century-long population decline. He has written some interesting things, but doesn't have the best rep among other anthros, probably partly for very good reason, and partly from jealousy (his books were best sellers I think in the early 1980s?). Do you think there would be any value to a 'chapter a day'? (This is actually why I asked the "can we discuss a chapter?" question. Except to help explain why an alien race who arrives on our planet to enslave us probably had better agricultural essay famine great interdisciplinary irelands circumstances than. In this case, their political unity came too early, and a few individual conservative despots were able to slow the march of "progress" in a way impossible in fragmented Europe. This was the system which forced Ireland and its peasantry into monoculture, since only the potato could be grown in sufficient quantity. Topic: Dec 15 Discussion: Guns, Germs Steel by Jared Diamond (38 of 71 Read 52 times Conf: reading list books From: Mary Anne Papale Date: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 08:52 PM Amen, sister, LOL. Shortly before the famine, the British government reported that poverty was so widespread that one-third of all Irish small holdings could not support the tenant families after rent was paid; the families survived only by earnings as seasonal migrant labour in England and Scotland. The Mahon family of Strokestown House evicted 3,000 people in 1847, and were still able to dine on lobster soup. No offense taken, I assure you. But man, does this guy suffer from lack of organization.
The "Hungry Forties", an analysis of the Chrononym External links. I think Diamond should be applauded for daring to paint the big picture. A bed or a blanket is a rare luxury. Also, Bo, this book, Guns Germs and Steel is very pertinent to your topic and interest in 'place'. I'm thinking essay famine great interdisciplinary irelands of two different types of horses-the ones that are military fighting ones and the other high kicking show ones-I never did learn their names. And one grabbed a toy from the other. I was on the Cormac McCarthy forum, and soem one had to 'walk me through' this idea. Ruth Topic: Jumping the Gun s Germs and Steel (30 of 56 Read 50 times Conf: reading list books From: Steve Warbasse Date: Tuesday, December 12, 2000 06:37 AM I was just asking, Theresa. One of the first things he suggested was the introduction of " Tenant-Right " as practised in Ulster, giving the landlord a fair rent for his land, but giving the tenant compensation for any money he might have laid. Those in East Roscommon "where conditions were more benign the estimated decline in population was under 10 percent.
It all made me think about reading Asimov's Foundation trilogy again. Um this has been a pretty funny discussion, both threads. Bo Topic: Dec 15 Discussion: Guns, Germs Steel by Jared Diamond (2 of 71 Read 54 times Conf: reading list books From: Mary Anne Papale Date: Friday, December 15, 2000 08:14 PM Bo, I don't know what's appropriate. But does every person and scientist have to be homogenous? My father died of starvation in Ireland in the black 47, Maybe you've heard. His book and thoughts are inspired by an emotional and experience rather than an intellectual befginning, and yet then we communicate with our intellect to have any worth in our culture, to have legitimacy. Mary Anne has pin pointed the part where I felt a chill down my spine. It's groups of people everybody needs to worry about. The emigrant would send remittances reaching 1,404,000 by 1851 back to family in Ireland, which, in turn, allowed another member of the family to leave. He was"d as saying that "he would not breed paupers to pay priests". I've noticed this tendency in other books written by scientists. When Ireland had experienced a famine in 178283, ports were closed to keep Irish-grown food in Ireland to feed the Irish.
How a person gets food is how they live. I think style does count in a book. Ruth Topic: Dec 15 Discussion: Guns, Germs Steel by Jared Diamond (46 of 71 Read 74 times Conf: reading list books From: Daniel LeBoeuf Date: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 11:26 AM I agree with Ruth to a certain degree-style. In June 1847 the Poor Law Amendment Act was passed which embodied the principle, popular in Britain, that Irish property must support Irish poverty. A b "The forgotten famine of 1879"publisher Irish History Bite Size self-published source? The other thing that crossed my mind was some guy's theory of moral development. Forget this guilt idea, how about some action or/and contemplation? One thing Diamond's book clearly does for me is heighten my thankfulness that I have lived my entire life in a dominant and temporarily stable society. Perhaps that made it essay famine great interdisciplinary irelands easy to swallow his perspective. Many of those fleeing to the Americas used the well-established McCorkell Line. However, it was asserted that the British parliament since the Act of Union of 1800 was partly to blame. Gould, of course, argues this is complete hogwash. So much for the idea of the Noble Savage living in perfect harmony with the rest of Mother Nature, Monsieur Rousseau.
204 205 Among the memorials in the US is the Irish Hunger Memorial near a section of the Manhattan waterfront in New York City, where many Irish arrived. You throw this book away, and you may be the person responsible for producing the civilization that engulfs the.S. By December, a third of a million destitute people were employed in public works. My take on this particular chapter's placement is that it sets up the fundamental Diamond analysis of proximate causes. Strangely, having stated his thesis so straightforwardly, Crosby never attempts to argue it in any systematic way. They constituted the vast majority of the population, 31 but they had been prohibited by the penal laws from purchasing or leasing land, voting, holding political office, living in or within 5 miles (8 km) of a corporate town, obtaining education. In February 1845, Devon reported: It would be impossible adequately to describe the privations which they the Irish labourer and his family habitually and silently endure. Consilience is selling science as the way to 'salvation' and Life Is A Miracle selling Christianity as a way 'salvation'. Topic: Jumping the Gun s Germs and Steel (53 of 56 Read 39 times Conf: reading list books From: Ann Davey Date: Tuesday, December 12, 2000 10:08 PM Candy, I think farmers are just the poor suckers who support the military and political elite.
War and such is probably very much our social nature. We seem to have lost sight essay famine great interdisciplinary irelands of the fact that Diamond never set out to address every single human interaction since time began. All in all I found it a good read. Emigration Main articles: Irish diaspora and Typhus epidemic of 1847 The Emigrants' Farewell, engraving by Henry Doyle (18271893 from Mary Frances Cusack 's Illustrated History of Ireland, 1868 While the famine was responsible for a significant increase in emigration. 2545, Symposium of the Mycological Society. Pennsylvania and Irish Famine Relief, 18461847. That, in itself, is a turn off for.
Compare those works of fiction where the author simply presents a story and allows the reader's imagination to fill in the detail. In Belgium the fields are said to be completely desolated. I'll reserve judgment until I finish the darn thing. Nature takes out species all the time. (Right up there with the absence of a prehensile tail.) My professor was suspiciously enthusiastic about pendular penises. One statement did make me laugh-when he stated that a history covering 13,000 years and five continents in 400 essay famine great interdisciplinary irelands pages had to be, of necessity, brief. I think the problem is that GGS is neither fish nor fowl nor good red herring. The bird isn't able to walk or do anything by itself because of the tail. University of Wisconsin Press. And my thoughts are leading me to comment that Diamond says much the same thing. Quinns books do not offer programs.
During the famine in Ethiopia, he used to scream, "Listen to me, people! Ruth Topic: Jumping the Gun s Germs and Steel (39 of 56 Read 45 times Conf: reading list books From: Candy Minx Date: Tuesday, essay famine great interdisciplinary irelands December 12, 2000 12:37 PM Oh ok, I understand. And I always think of ways of speaking and thinking and living as organic material. MAP Topic: Dec 15 Discussion: Guns, Germs Steel by Jared Diamond (29 of 71 Read 40 times Conf: reading list books From: Candy Minx Date: Monday, December 18, 2000 09:03 PM I could be confused but. Except for the pygmies, the people looked very much alike. There were about 1 million long-distance emigrants between 18, mainly to North America. This was just an example that easily came to mind when I was posting; there are plenty of others. It's plain and simple. Call me crazy, I don't know.
A b Smith, Roberta. They would split a holding into smaller and smaller parcels so as to increase the amount of rent they could obtain. Fanon would be a much better literary reference than Diamond for the point I think you are trying to make. lv Lee, Joseph. Gregory became the husband of Lady Gregory. Conversely, where we have no wide 'world view' and no sense of ourselves in relation to a larger social whole, our functioning is at a much lower level.
I think the teacher you work with Dan is completely justified in her feelings since she must really believe in this. Like Candy, I don't think it'll stand the test of time but according to my book journal, it made me think. Personally, I believe World War I is very close to being a modern, western, version of the Hutu-Tustse slaughter. He made an analogy about Romans in outlying posts-they didn't think, "Geeze, weren't we a bit hard on these folks?" No-they were proud of their accomplishment. The " Gregory clause described by Donnelly as a "vicious amendment to the Irish poor law had been a successful Tory amendment to the Whig poor-relief bill which became law in early June 1847, where its potential as an estate-clearing. In any event, perhaps because I am so ill read on this subject, I am finding Guns, Germs, and Steel pretty fascinating. I mean the reason he goes on and on is because he has to present his argument and then back it up? The combination of institutional and figures provided by individuals gives "an incomplete and biased count" of fatalities during the famine. English rule drove me and mine out of Ireland. References American University (1996 Irish Potato Famine and Trade, American University, retrieved 24 September 2010 Balch, William Stevens (1850). However, that line of explanation, Crosby writes, seemed insufficient to account for the scale of European dominance. "The Great Irish Famine in Songs". In the European view of the time, significant (but not nearly all, of course) parts of life were mutable and subject to conscious manipulation; if you didn't like how things 'were then you acted to change them.